Authentic Marketing & Branding with Shauna Van Mourik

Welcome to the guy who knows a guy podcast.

I am your host, Michael Whitehouse, the guy who knows a guy himself.

And we are recording live to tape at Potapalooza number 15.

Over the last five years, I've had the privilege of meeting and learning

from thousands of entrepreneurs, experts, and awesome people.

And now I leverage that knowledge to help my clients cut through the

junk and focus on what they need to achieve their goals at our next guest.

Fits along with this because Sha Shana van work, did I say that right?

Shauna Van Mork.

You got it.

Shana Van Morwick.

Look at that.

Here's, um, Shauna empowers women coaches and therapists to create positive impact

through authentic branding and marketing strategies that attract dream clients.

And I was just telling Shauna last week, I ran the Authentic Marketing Summit.

So that is a concept that is very much near and dear to my heart, and I'm

looking forward to a conversation about.

Authentic marketing and branding.

So let's start it off there.

What does authentic marketing and branding mean to you?

Well, I love it.

Well, I can start by saying what it doesn't mean to me.

Okay.

Um, and this is a really important distinction because.

When we're doing our branding, we like to look at words, brand tone, words,

personality, that sort of thing.

And people like to use these buzzwords like authentic, but they mean

different things to different people.

I think it's a really important concept to understand that.

One word may not be mean the same thing to everyone.

So for me, and this does not mean that it's for everyone for me being authentic

does not mean recording myself ugly crying in a closet for some people.

That's the way they rock.

And I'm like, Hey, man, you do you that's all right.

Uh, but it doesn't look like that for me.

For me, authenticity does not look like airing out dirty laundry.

For many people who I work with, they choose not to show their

family life, their personal life.

And that's okay.

I do.

So for me, my authentic.

Expression of self includes, guess what?

I'm a mom to three kids and we are hooligans.

Like I am a child at heart.

So you're going to see me playing Legos, digging in the snow, and

maybe even jumping on a trampoline.

That's just who I am.

And so for me, let's flip the script.

Authenticity is genuinely just being me and my favorite self.

I don't say best self purposefully because that can be really heavy for a lot of

people and you will never always be your best self, but I be my favorite self

and I show up in that way to all of you.

Transparent, honest, authentic, genuine, whatever the heck you,

weird, quirky, fun, making faces.

That's authenticity to me.

And that's what I bring into my marketing.

I like that.

And I think some of the ideas that, um, You don't share everything,

but everything you share is true.

Yes.

And intentional.

Right.

Consider, you know, when you're sitting and talking to a friend, and I think this

is a really important part of marketing and branding is understanding that

marketing isn't a sales tactic, right?

Marketing, if you use it that way, that's called BS rhetoric, right?

That's called bullshit rhetoric.

That's when you're trying to persuade and coerce, and that feels icky.

We don't want that.

Yes.

Right.

Marketing is meant to build a relationship.

So if you're talking to your friend, are you going to tell them what you

did in bed last night with your spouse?

Maybe?

I don't know.

I don't know what your friendships are like, but not likely.

So we need to kind of understand Who we're talking to, who we are, and

make sure that we're bridging that gap in a way that feels aligned to us

and makes sense for the circumstance.

Yeah, that's, that's good.

And, and, and you're talking about, you know, being you and

being your, your favorite self.

I like that concept.

And I, I always say, I, I'm always me because I can't keep track of anyone else.

So like the idea of, I'm always, Impressed, not in a good way,

by the people who are like one persona on stage and then off

stage they're a different person.

Like, how do you keep track of who you're supposed to be?

Why don't you speak to the person all the time?

You know what, on that note, something that I used to talk about this all

the time, and this is actually the first time in quite a while that

it's been brought up, is I talked about this concept of a suitcase.

And people who and specifically in relation to masking, which is what

I believe you're talking about.

Um, these personas, these masks that you wear and people will drag around

this heavy suitcase laden with masks.

You can't go far with that.

It's freaking heavy, right?

You're dragging it around.

You're exhausted.

When you take off that mask, who you actually are is not who it

isn't your favorite self typically.

So if you can just friggin ditch that briefcase and just come to it as you

are your favorite self It's a lot easier to number one Meet the right people who

jive with what you're doing and number two go far with those people Absolutely.

Yeah People used to ask me who my target audience my email list was and

I said I guess it's people who like me Because at the time I didn't really

have great clarity on what my target audience was Business solution was,

but I was running summits and events.

I was building a list and people would come in and some would stay and some

would leave and I was like, well, I guess the ones who stay, they like what

I write and the ones who leave, they don't like what I write and I was doing

a super great job converting them.

But I found it worked well because I'd bring them in.

They would like me.

They trust me.

I'd refer affiliate partners.

They would buy from those affiliate partners.

Sometimes they buy from me.

Uh, but that was my target audience, people who liked me.

And if they didn't like what I said, well, they can go.

That's why there's three unsubscribed links on every email.

They can leave any time they want.

And that's a great place to start.

It's a great place to start because then you start tapping into who am I?

What do I believe in?

And then starting to ask more, um, business driven questions like, what

am I, what is, what am I trying to do?

Right?

What is the objective here from a business strategy point of view?

Right?

What am I trying to sell?

What problem am I trying to solve?

And then for whom and how, right?

All of those questions just kind of, um, are birthed, are blossomed out of it.

But starting from that place of who the hell am I?

And do you even like me?

And if you like me, do I care one way or the other?

And then it starts with the mindset work and all that jazz.

But that's about discovering your personal brand and how you want that personal brand

to seep into your professional brand.

I love it.

Yeah.

Yeah, that's, that's good.

And you know, I like to say that your personal brand, they're saying

a lot of people, if all they know of business is big companies, And so

they have this idea of what a brand should be in a professional brand.

And, you know, and that's a mix of how they should present themselves

for corporate, which is remove anything that could offend anyone.

Cause if you offend your boss, you lose your job.

Um, plus corporate ends up being a little bit impersonal cause they have

to cause they're a corporation and they end up giving away the greatest asset

they have as a sole entrepreneur, which is they're already a person, you know.

Progressive spends millions of dollars to create flow.

Geico spends millions of dollars to create the gecko.

Because they don't have a person, so they have to invent a person.

And all of us solopreneurs, we've already got a person!

That's exactly it, and I love the way you put that.

That is so perfect, because truthfully, I, and first of all, I'm going to steal that.

And second of all, I, I, I think that, When you're able to just come, come as

you are, so to speak, it makes every other decision in your business a lot easier.

And that's kind of why we do it, right?

We didn't want to be caged in the corporate life to be shackled to

someone else's sense of what is success.

We wanted to create our own.

We wanted to really develop a lifestyle that made sense for us and our

values and the way we want to live.

You know, I've got sourdough starters sitting on my stove right now.

I'm going to be making some muffins.

Would I be doing that if I was stuck to a nine to five until,

you know, six o'clock at night?

Probably not.

But I get to because I have breaks when I want breaks.

It makes a difference.

So tapping into your authentic self, who you are, how you express yourself

is a really great way to create the life that is perfect for that self.

It's very true.

Yeah.

So you work primarily with women coaches and therapists?

Yeah.

I do.

Yes.

And so what are some of the unique challenges they have around

this authentic marketing and how are you able to help them?

Well, we already addressed one of them, and that is this idea of, of,

you know, the corporate mentality bleeding into their business.

But the other aspect of that is really the fact that they are Predominantly

the helpers and being the helper.

And I know this from experience being the helper, you just,

you want to be in service.

You want to do the job.

You want to help the person, but being a business owner, right?

Working for yourself, you need to provide yourself with the people to help.

And that's a whole nother ball game, right?

So while they have immense skill and knowledge in their helper expertise.

They may not have that same skill and knowledge as a business professional.

And so what I find happens is they start wearing all the hats because they need to.

I get it.

You're put into this position where, oh, my goodness, I'm a

solopreneur, a micro business owner.

I need to.

Also be marketer and sales and this and that and the other and you're overwhelmed

and you're riding the hamster wheel and now you're only serving two people

and you don't even have the time to onboard another person, let alone the

other person standing in line because you weren't marketing effectively in the

first place because you didn't know how.

And that is frustrating.

It's exhausting.

So this is where I see a lot of these coaches, therapists, women entrepreneurs

in general, um, who, you know, they have, they have to juggle all these balls.

Right?

Um, the important part of this, and this is actually something that Nora

Roberts, an author, um, mentioned is, you know, while you're juggling

all these balls, you need to be able to realize that some of those balls

are glass and some are plastic.

All you need to worry about is not dropping the glass balls.

Mm hmm.

Right.

It's okay.

Let the plastic balls go.

Eventually, when you're focusing on those glass ones, the things that

really matter to you, you'll get into a space where you can maybe have a

part time helper with your marketing, with your branding, with your VA work,

somebody to handle your, your emails, whatever it looks like, whatever would

really create that impact, right?

That plastic ball that's starting to turn glass.

That's the one you outsource.

So I would say that to answer your questions, those, those coaches and

therapists, they're really juggling everything Because they are the

helper trying to be the business person and they need to ask for help.

And it can be hard for the helper to ask for help.

I know that was a convoluted way to answer that question.

But here I am all of me makes a lot of sense.

Makes a lot of sense.

Yeah.

And they're, they're so focused on and that's challenging.

The helper is they want to help everyone and so they put themselves last burn

themselves out, try and do everything and then helping no one because.

They burn themselves out.

Um, now I'm also, I just noticed the book behind you that says F, yeah, for

a moment I was like, I was trying to figure out what letter was missing.

I'm like, oh, no, that says F, there's no letter missing.

Yeah, that says F the shoulds and do the wants.

Yep.

This was actually a gift that my husband gave me for, uh, for Christmas this year.

I haven't finished it all yet, but it's a great read.

Um, it is by Tricia Huffman, the, and she's a geologist PS geologist.

Freaking love that.

Um, but the, my, my husband knows I like these types of books, but the

main reason that he got this for me, I just wanted to his horn for a moment

because it was very well thought out.

Um, this book.

It was not available, like, anywhere for a long time, and this book in

particular, because there were only a few of them, where the foreword, give me a

moment, where the foreword was actually signed, not by the author, by the person

who wrote the foreword, Jason Mraz.

Jason Mraz has a song where he says, F in the shoulds.

And so he's gotten the, he's written the forward for this.

Now, I don't know how Trisha got him to write the forward, but I

need to get him to write forward for my book when it comes out.

Anyways, this is, it's brilliant.

Uh, Jason's a brilliant musician who really taps into that, that feeling of

authenticity and lifestyle and advocating for the things that matter most in your

life and really just tapping into the joy.

And of course, Trisha being a also does the same thing.

Um, So yeah, F the shoulds and just do whatever the hell you want.

Yeah, yeah, one of the, one of the things that we, we often say in our, in our, uh,

events in my community is don't should all, don't should all over yourself.

Yes, I have a friend who says the same thing and you're right.

Because all clients will be like, yeah, I know I should have a podcast

or I, but most often it's social media.

I know I should be on Facebook.

I'm like, who said you should be on Facebook.

And they're like, well, you're on Facebook.

And I'm like, yeah, I'm not you.

Who said you should be on Facebook?

Yeah, I know I should be on Facebook.

I really hate it.

Well, then you probably shouldn't be on Facebook.

Why would you do something you hate?

What did your boss tell you?

Exactly.

I love that.

And actually that taps into something that I frequently preach almost anywhere

I can go is, uh, people often ask me, well, What should I be creating?

And I said, Well, listen, I'm not going to tell you what you should be creating,

but I'm going to tell you a way to think about what you could create, right?

And this is the way I do it.

Um, I speak in regards to a Venn diagram.

I use my hands as the circles.

I'm a very visual person.

So I tell people to think about what you love to create, how you love to create it

in the format that you love to create it.

The content, right?

Do you love to write?

Do you love videos?

Do you like talking about what pillars, you know, for lack of a better word,

you know, the content pillars, um, what do you love to talk about and

how do you love to talk about it?

Are you conversational?

Are you professional?

All of that goes into this first bin.

The 2nd, 1 is.

Know your ideal audience.

What do they love to consume?

How do they love to consume it?

In what medium?

In what format?

In what dialogue?

In what tone?

Overlap those.

And that's where you create that little overlap right there.

If you can find out what exists in that overlap, that's where you're going to

find the most joy and the best yield on whatever you're producing when it

comes to ROI and clients coming in.

Yeah, that's a very powerful way to think about it.

And, and yeah, the, and of course the thing with the shoulds is like the

reason you start your own business.

It's not so you could turn yourself into your own boss.

That's right.

So you can be your own boss, but not that kind of boss.

You gotta just relax into it, be authentic in how you're showing up in

your brand, but also in your marketing and that includes your strategy.

This is something that I often, get a lot of, Um, I don't want to say it's

pushback, but, uh, the objections we talk about objections a lot.

Of course, the objections that I get about marketing strategy is this idea that,

oh, no, a strategy is going to cage me.

Um, and I want to kind of dismiss that as a myth.

Um, and this is why outdated marketing strategies may feel like a cage, but

if you are progressive thinking, and if you understand the way you can optimize

digital marketing, Authentically, and in a way that feels aligned, then you're

going to be able to create a strategy that allows for emotive, intuitive posting

and creation and connection, right?

You're going to create a strategy that keeps yourself aligned with

your foundation and your goal.

Make sure that you're actually being attentive to the details,

your client journey, et cetera, all those tactical, practical things.

Keeps you posting regularly, consistently.

We know consistency is key.

We hear that all the time, but it also leaves room for

playfulness, creativity, advocacy.

And if you're able to create a strategy like that, now it's freeing.

Now it's intentional.

It allows you to achieve goals that far surpass monetary gains in your business.

But it also allows you to step into your life in a way that's

meaningful and impactful.

And that's where I come from when it comes to creating a marketing strategy that

not only converts, but feels good, too.

Yeah, and I think what's great about that kind of strategy, you know, systems create

freedom, um, as opposed to limitations, and people don't realize that.

And one thing, you know, I find I have different energy levels, different

days, but I like writing, and I usually have something I want to rant about.

So, because I have a system, I have an email list.

And I've built an audience who likes reading my stuff.

So when I'm like, uh, I don't feel like working today.

I'm just going to rant about something.

I'm not working.

I'm just ranting and then sending it to my email list and putting it on LinkedIn.

Um, but that's not work.

That's just writing about stuff.

And then the stress goes away because like, well, what if I offend someone?

Cause they're probably not my people.

Now I do always, you know, I want to make sure I'm not going

to offend someone by accident.

Cause you know, I said something the wrong way, or I explained it the wrong

way, or I misquoted somebody or whatever.

I don't want to offend someone not being me, but if I offend you because

I'm me, and because I have an opinion, that's a you problem, not a me problem.

Especially if you lead with kindness.

This is an integral rule of my life and business.

Um, I too have a podcast, Marketing Rebels, Breaking Business Barriers,

and in my rebellious state, I still, Maintain this cardinal

rule that you lead with kindness.

So while I say, uh, while I, while I vehemently agree, who

cares if you offend somebody?

I don't mean that from the bigoted sense.

I mean that from the sense that you have intentionally led with kindness and you

are creating an inclusive and loving space for all, but still voicing an opinion

and, and you're not out there to cause harm.

So like all of those things to say, if someone disagrees,

okay, show yourself to the door.

That's okay.

Bye.

Mhm.

Still be okay with it.

Yeah.

Causing that sort of cognitive dissonance within people is actually a really great

tool to leverage within your marketing.

But I feel like that would take us down another whole pathway.

If we don't there, we've got like 2 minutes left.

So I'm definitely have to bring you back.

You're on a summit or 6.

Because I do run quite a few of them and I would love to have you there.

Um, but we are out of running out of time and they're telling us they're

about to shut down the podatorium.

So we got to finish up before that is over.

Uh, and you are wrapping up my day of podcasts and.

A great interview to wrap up my day with.

So, Shanna, what is your final thought and how can people get in touch with you?

Most gracious.

Uh, my thoughts never end, first of all.

Final thought for now.

For now.

For the, in the moment, live in the moment, be present.

Maybe that is my final thought.

Maybe that is my final thought.

And that's what I'm, the gift I'm going to give to you and all of

the viewers here is Be present.

Touch base with yourself and who you are and who you want to be, the

goals that you want to accomplish.

And the only way to do that is to really pause, take a minute, and touch base with

yourself to be present in the moment.

Uh, there's a Jason Mraz song about that too, Be Where Your Feet Are.

Shameless promotion.

It's fabulous.

It's hilarious to watch the music video.

Um, and finally, if you want to reach out to me to say boo, uh, absolutely.

Go to my website.

Go to shaunaleigh.

com.

That's S H A U N A L E I G H dot com.

On there, you're going to find all of my socials.

Reach out to me.

DM me.

I'm pretty well everywhere.

Um, very intentionally so.

And um, if you say hi, I will say hi back.

I'm not that person who holds myself up on a pedestal somewhere.

I'm here.

I'm the people's people and I will be like, How's it going?

Let's let's I don't know talk about your dog.

I'm here for it.

So absolutely connects awesome That's shauna s h a u n a

l e i g h at least half.

Those letters are silent.

That's why I read them all out Um shauna lee.

com.

So great to have you on here and um And thank you and don't go

away because I want to talk to you about getting you on a summit.

Absolutely.

Sounds fabulous.